Thread: Td5 vs tdci

Full disclosure- I drive a puma, and have only driven a TD5 powered vehicle once.
Like others have suggested, this is a fruitless debate.

In puma's defence, most of the issues that have been quoted are, let's face it, minor. Hoses can be changed, output shafts are not outrageously expensive, and the engine itself is by all accounts a capable unit with decent power and economy in a compact package. Major mechanical failures are rare- on par or better than most other vehicles.

It should be noted that TD5's are not without their issues as well. But not my place to say.

Originally Posted by PAT303

Rob,I've towed my Cub Camper all over WA,the TDCi tows fine,as for outback reliability,I've driven mine to more places than 90% of 4wd's will ever go without issue's.I'll stand by my original comments,the TDCi is the best Defender. Pat

Hey Pat,

Has your Puma been tweaked or is it standard? I realise along flat roads, etc that both the Td5 & puma will tow ok, but it's the slight inclines, hills, etc. I'm wanting a vehicle that will tow reasonably well and would be able to pass others w/o having to wait for a piece of straight road 5kms long just so I can get around. I know there's no real substitute for cubic inch when it comes to performance, but I just don't want something that when I'm towing out 17" van that every incline/hill that I come to that the vehicle dies in the ar*e & I'm back down to 60/70ks on the Hwy... A good mate of mine has the 2.4 Puma 130 and he's quite often telling me how poor his tows his 5.7mtr boat. He's now considering the performance upgrade for his as he's been told that there's around a 50% increase in performance or there abouts.....

I like both the TD5 and PUMA, but trying to decide which one would meet my needs is proving quite difficult as I'm hoping the next vehicle we get will be the last one for a very long time to come.... Then I also need to consider the missus and even those she is pretty easy going, I feel the interior of the PUMA would suit her better as well......

I recently had to change the Injectors in the wife's '10 Prado 150 D4d at the 160k Service which in my eyes turned out to be a VERY costly exercise, but upon talking to other people and different vehicle makes, it looks like it wasn't too bad. Toyota in their service schedule never mention injector replacement but talk to most mechanics or those experienced with the D4d and they will tell u that u should replace them at 100k.... Now, I run a AUX 2 micron Fuel Filter + I've always tried to fuel up a the local BP Servo and use their BP Ultimate Diesel to try and prevent the injectors from having to be replaced, but it looks like it just delayed the inevitable....

My question is what is the service life of the PUMA and TD5 injectors? If the vehicle is serviced well and filters changed accordingly, do u have to ever change the Injectors in the TD5 and PUMA?

I got quoted from MR Auto that TD5 injectors are about $800>$880 each (Ouch, that's dear).
Looking on the Web, the PUMA ones off Paddocks is around $325 each which is cheaper that what I had to pay for my Toyota injectors. I'm not sure if there would be many PUMAs out there with HIGH kms on them, but after having to fork out some big $$ for our car, it got me wondering what to expect with the PUMA & TD5's. Do the TD5's injectors ever need replacing?

btw: from searching on the web, the Injectors for the PUMA's are about half the price of the TD5 injectors....

rob

I have never driven a td5. I like the sound of them when modified.

I am am extremely happy with my 2.2. I have the tune and intercooler with silicone hoses and decat done. On road and off road I cannot complain at all. That along with the newer interior makes me a happy owner. Enough power for my needs and maintenance so far has been great

Hi,
I have had all Defender models privately and provided by my employer and currently own a 300Tdi big cab auto and a puma 2.2 130 dual cab, my family also a 110 2.2 wagon and feel I can comment on towing as we regularly tow either a horse float or an off road van weighing about 1800-1900kgs.

My experience is that the 300tdi is great but slow so when getting into pumas expected more--I am sorry but my 130 puma struggles when towing particularly on long up hill gradients--only yesterday on the run from the Hawkesbury River bridge up hill towards Mt Colah I was being passed by all and sundry also with vans, boats--yet on steep sections it actually is not too bad. However taking off from traffic lights when there is a slight incline is embarrasing!

My car has not had any issues and is regularly dealer serviced so as to keep my Rover Assist as now just out of warranty but I have decided that for towing it is lacking for me--so I will be looking at either a 3.2ltr transplant or a vehicle change. If I can get it done and keep the other aspects of the puma model then maybe a retro fit of an Isuzu turbo 3.9 might be possible as is being done here in Sydney by some LR people. The 110 in the family is also overly affected by towing--it really is in my opinion that the cubic capacity is insufficient when towing although unloaded they perform brilliantly. I think the TD5 if I remember was better at towing but it is quite a while since I have driven one.

I know that I can have the 2.2 performance improved but still feel it is low down torgue that is what I am after.

If any members have had a successful engine transplant done please let me know.
Thanks,
Alan

I drive Defenders of both types frequently. I personally wouldn't own either, but my preference would be for a Td5. It seems like a lot of people like the MT-82 but I certainly don't count myself among them. The sad fact is that no matter how much more power you wring out of the little puma, the extra (notchy, horrible feeling) gear change to get to a reasonable speed keeps you slower than a Td5 with the same money spent on it. Perhaps all this is emphasised by how brilliant is the R380 is.

Someone also brought up the inability to self prime; incredibly frustrating in a rugged 4x4. If you have a compressor on board you can pressurise the tank, but you shouldn't have to. Pressurising the tank is far from a silver bullet at any rate.

I've also seen Pumas with corrosion problems that earlier Defenders seem to have avoided entirely like around joins in the roof and the under-tub reinforcement.

The most important point for me though, is that I simply don't enjoy the Puma driving experience. I would like to try a Puma - R380 combination though.

Rob,all vehicles will slow down on hills especially towing a 5.7m boat.Mine sits on 70 going up some of the hills down south but who cares,owners of bigger engined vehicles do the same,they use to much fuel otherwise.I'm the first to admit the TDCi could use more torque,but then again it's done lots of outback driving,just like my old Tdi.Forget the BS about adapter splines etc,it's a known problem,fix it and move on,same with the weak diff,I've never broken one or a rover for that matter,and all my eight LR's I've owned to date have worked for their living. Pat

Originally Posted by Dervish

I drive Defenders of both types frequently. I personally wouldn't own either, but my preference would be for a Td5. It seems like a lot of people like the MT-82 but I certainly don't count myself among them. The sad fact is that no matter how much more power you wring out of the little puma, the extra (notchy, horrible feeling) gear change to get to a reasonable speed keeps you slower than a Td5 with the same money spent on it. Perhaps all this is emphasised by how brilliant is the R380 is.

Someone also brought up the inability to self prime; incredibly frustrating in a rugged 4x4. If you have a compressor on board you can pressurise the tank, but you shouldn't have to. Pressurising the tank is far from a silver bullet at any rate.

I've also seen Pumas with corrosion problems that earlier Defenders seem to have avoided entirely like around joins in the roof and the under-tub reinforcement.

The most important point for me though, is that I simply don't enjoy the Puma driving experience. I would like to try a Puma - R380 combination though.

Someone brought up the inability to self prime who doesn't know what he's talking about,I've run my TDCi out of fuel twice on purpose and refilling it with fuel it started both times straight away.It becomes a problem if you do something stupid like remove the fuel filter with it running or fitting an empty filter and starting it. Pat