Thread: EV general discussion

Fits here NavyDiver. It is general discussion, involves an EV, and this is the Grumpy EV thread.

I would hit “like” but that feels wrong. We need a “D’oh!“ button.

Just adding to my earlier post. This analysis highlights the real problem with EV’s in Australia. Spoiler alert: The problem is not EV’s - it’s where we get our power from.

Are EVs greener than ICE vehicles?

I don’t agree with all the assumptions and it doesn’t consider that the energy mix is changing and will continue to improve (meaning the break even point also continues to improve).

But the analysis comparing the energy mix in Australia v.s. the World v.s. Europe and the impact this has on the total lifecycle emissions highlights the big differences you will see in different studies, and why moving away from fossil fuels is the key.

Should stress this is not using current data. The energy mix data looks like it is quoting 2018/2019 data. Our electricity is now reported to be over 35% renewables, not 21% that was used in the study, and we should be on track to hit 50% by 2025.

So the break even point will only continue to improve as we generate more electricity from renewable sources (and is already much better than this study reported - would be closer to 90,000kms in Australia for the particular car used in this analysis vs. 49,000kms if run from 100% renewables).

Edit: and if you are interested in knowing where the original source data came from, it is from this report published by Volvo.

Volvo C40 Recharge Carbon Footprint Report

Originally Posted by Captain_Rightfoot

You haven't included your sources.. I could provide stuff but I really doubt you'd listen to it anyway. There is so much FUD on the web.

What part of this was it you don't understand? The ev emits only 1/3 the co2 for the same trip as the defender. How long do you really think it's going to take to offset the additional co2 produced in its manufacture? I know.. forever right.

TABLE for you.
KM 134
Cost CO2
Tesla $3.57 15.3KG
TD5 $30.86 42.24 KG

Unlike the Defender, the tesla will continue to put out lower emissions throughout it's life as the grid greens. At the end of it's life the battery is very close to 100% recyclable. Lithium and Iron. No cobalt thanks. If I sell the car before it's end of life, it will not immediately cease to exist but it's lower emissions will continue to benefit society.

So you're crazy worried about issues with producing EV batteries, but you're totally OK with oil extraction and all the issues that brings? Are you aware that each litre of fuel could have a co2 overhead of as much as 30% depending on field etc? Can we count that in this? Moving tankers around the world has resulted in some stupendous disasters and mining usually makes quite the mess. Are you ok with the cobalt used in the process of refining oil?



I was riding next to a main road in Brisbane yesterday. All I could smell was diesel and petrol smells. My lungs sucking in that pollution. I rode past shops, childcare centres, schools. Why isn't clean air a thing? Isn't emitting it away from population centres a good idea?

If you're really worried about the environment the best answer is to not drive. Not volunteering? I can't get everyone in this house to volunteer either. So four people using one EV seems like it's worth a shot.

If the above is Tin's present Boat someone should mention to him that he seems to have a few problems other than some minor daggy wiring & a few scratches.

Originally Posted by Captain_Rightfoot

You haven't included your sources.. I could provide stuff but I really doubt you'd listen to it anyway. There is so much FUD on the web.

What part of this was it you don't understand? The ev emits only 1/3 the co2 for the same trip as the defender. How long do you really think it's going to take to offset the additional co2 produced in its manufacture? I know.. forever right.

TABLE for you.
KM 134
Cost CO2
Tesla $3.57 15.3KG
TD5 $30.86 42.24 KG

Unlike the Defender, the tesla will continue to put out lower emissions throughout it's life as the grid greens. At the end of it's life the battery is very close to 100% recyclable. Lithium and Iron. No cobalt thanks. If I sell the car before it's end of life, it will not immediately cease to exist but it's lower emissions will continue to benefit society.

So you're crazy worried about issues with producing EV batteries, but you're totally OK with oil extraction and all the issues that brings? Are you aware that each litre of fuel could have a co2 overhead of as much as 30% depending on field etc? Can we count that in this? Moving tankers around the world has resulted in some stupendous disasters and mining usually makes quite the mess. Are you ok with the cobalt used in the process of refining oil?



I was riding next to a main road in Brisbane yesterday. All I could smell was diesel and petrol smells. My lungs sucking in that pollution. I rode past shops, childcare centres, schools. Why isn't clean air a thing? Isn't emitting it away from population centres a good idea?

If you're really worried about the environment the best answer is to not drive. Not volunteering? I can't get everyone in this house to volunteer either. So four people using one EV seems like it's worth a shot.

His sources are the bloody huge global company he works for not the web - I won’t name it and he hasn’t but trust me, Tombie has access to the facts and figures - undiluted by propaganda on either side of the fence - they need that for what they do.

Let’s just say that knowing what he does (sorta) and knowing the company he works for - I believe him.

Originally Posted by Homestar

His sources are the bloody huge global company he works for not the web - I won’t name it and he hasn’t but trust me, Tombie has access to the facts and figures - undiluted by propaganda on either side of the fence - they need that for what they do.

Let’s just say that knowing what he does (sorta) and knowing the company he works for - I believe him.

Do tell us Tombie - who is this huge global company that has access to facts and figures not shared with the public?

(Serious question - as I too have worked for huge global companies, and I still work in the mining and resources industry, and the data they had supports moving to a renewable energy future of which EV’s are a big part of this).

Originally Posted by 4bee

Mind you given a choice I would have preferred an Ammonia TEV. Big orifice you see.

Originally Posted by scarry

The pilot operated model

Then there is the oriface plate in a 600 KW Centrifugal.

How many inches of errr mercury is the discharge pressure on these?

Originally Posted by DiscoDB

Do tell us Tombie - who is this huge global company that has access to facts and figures not shared with the public?

(Serious question - as I too have worked for huge global companies, and I still work in the mining and resources industry, and the data they had supports moving to a renewable energy future of which EV’s are a big part of this).

Originally Posted by Homestar

His sources are the bloody huge global company he works for not the web - I won’t name it and he hasn’t but trust me, Tombie has access to the facts and figures - undiluted by propaganda on either side of the fence - they need that for what they do.

Let’s just say that knowing what he does (sorta) and knowing the company he works for - I believe him.

Govt's are not totally stupid and are going to institute CO2 import tariffs against, if not outright bans and criminal charges against companies and individuals that think they can do the wrong thing in far flung corners of the world. Carbon Border Adjustment Mechanism (europa.eu)

Why should he have to tell anyone here where he works or what he does? Believe him or don’t, pretty simple. He’s not running for an election or anything.

Do you really expect him to share company information that is private and confidential to a forum? Just because a couple of people here don’t believe what he’s saying?