Elon in the pooh - again!

**Homestar** · 4th October 2018, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Tesla's major problems have little to do with Musk. Just look around - how many new, startup, car manufacturers are there that have come from nothing in the last fifty years, except for those with massive government support and protection. (Which Tesla does not have, and is unlikely to get)

The car manufacturing scene has changed massively in the last fifty years - but there are not many new names - and the names that are new are mostly existing manufacturers from countries that used not to export. Certainly ownership has changed a lot, but far more have disappeared than new ones have succeeded. Plenty of new ones have appeared - and then disappeared. Tesla is ahead of most in that they have actually delivered a significant number of cars!

Tesla did in fact get a massive government loan to get them off the ground some years ago - which, to their credit they paid off years early. It is doubtful they would have got to where they are now without it, but your points are valid, they now get zero from any subsidies and are actually producing production vehicles.

**JDNSW** · 4th October 2018, 12:02 PM

I am not sure that the description 'massive' applies compared to the subsidies and import protection given to Toyota, Mitsubishi, General Motors, British Leyland, Fiat, Volvo (and others) that are still around, not to mention those that are not, such as Holden, Santana, and many others.

**Homestar** · 4th October 2018, 12:22 PM

Not disagreeing John, others get far more for delivering far less but I think it was around US $500 million to get them off the ground - I'm also not saying that was a bad idea, just saying is all. As I've said before in this thread I have no beef with Tesla or EV's, just the dipstick in charge....

DiscoMick · 5th October 2018, 04:51 PM

I read that the German car companies get enormous hidden subsidies by exemptions on local, state and national taxes. Pretty sure the same is true in Japan. Certainly true in Thailand. Not unusual.

**JDNSW** · 5th October 2018, 06:53 PM

No, and despite this few car manufacturers actually operate consistently in the black except by some creative accounting!

DiscoMick · 5th October 2018, 07:15 PM

The Thais don't muck around. They just whacked on import duties of about 400% to stifle imports. Don't like it? Tell the generals and see what happens.

**JDNSW** · 6th October 2018, 05:40 AM

And many other countries did the same sort of thing - including Australia for about sixty or seventy years. Started being reduced here when the voting public started to realise that the major result was a limited selection of expensive and/or antiquated, cars while propping up manufacturing in a few locations but still requiring massive subsidies.

DiscoMick · 7th October 2018, 06:48 PM

Yes, they have to export most of their production, as Thailand has done, to be successful.
It's interesting to stand in a car park and count how many of the vehicles visible were made in Thailand.

**Eevo** · 7th October 2018, 10:33 PM

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

Yes, they have to export most of their production, as Thailand has done, to be successful.
It's interesting to stand in a car park and count how many of the vehicles visible were made in Thailand.

which manufactures come from thailand?

DiscoMick · 8th October 2018, 01:12 PM

Many of the vehicles on our roads are made in Thailand.

Thread: Elon in the pooh - again!

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