Won’t be retro...

**JDNSW** · 23rd April 2019, 05:57 AM

Landrover has had the issue with the Defender that it has been developed from a 1948 design which had low power and a low GVM, and has put on weight and power ever since. With backward compatibility being a major feature, there has been an ongoing problem with ensuring that the drive train can cope with the increased power. A locker enables the full available torque to be applied to a single wheel if the centre diff is locked and the other three wheels can slip, so the drive train has to be able to cope with that. A further complication has been that Defenders have always had substantially lower 'lowest gear' than most of their competitors, and have always been manuals. (lower gear means more torque multiplication)

Landrover has relied on better articulation than their competitors rather than lockers, which can in some cases be seen as an easy way of compensating for limited articulation.

However, the new Defender will be a completely new design, so no need to think of backward compatibility, and I'm guessing, will be automatic only, removing the possibility of shock loads to the drive train from sudden clutch engagement (but still possible from rock hopping, although traction control may minimise it).

TB · 23rd April 2019, 06:37 AM

What I can see in the vids is still the front wheel losing traction and spinning briefly before getting under control. Hard to tell whether that control comes from traction control or a front e-diff reacting. Based on the Discovery and RRS experience, I would be surprised and disappointed if there was *not* a rear e-diff option on the new ICE-based Defender. An actual locking diff on the front doesn't seem likely to me though.

Another option for limiting front wheel spin might be to use the Active Driveline technology from the rear of Evoque and Disco Sport and apply it to the front axle. That tech is made by GKN and called "Twinster". I note with interest GKN's newest "eTwinsterX" rear drive electric motor with torque vectoring and have to wonder whether it might feature on electric versions of MLA vehicles such as Defender.

Combining All-wheel Drive Fuel Efficiency | GKN technology 2016 | GKN Group
The eTwinsterX could revolutionise the way we drive electrified cars. Find out why.

**blackrangie** · 23rd April 2019, 07:48 AM

Originally Posted by rick130

Lockers have never been available at all for the Deefer in the past, so I'm not sure why they'd suddenly make them an option across the range in the future?

Gwagon and the fact that the only public that has seen them thinks so. I believe terrain response activates lockers on/off so can't see why they wouldn't do front also, unless its simply not needed.

**blackrangie** · 23rd April 2019, 07:49 AM

YouTube

Big news here guys!

**ozscott** · 23rd April 2019, 08:43 AM

If Lucky8 are right (see all of thr discussion above about D5 style coolers in the front skirt area...) means it is not correct to say that putting them.their is OK for offroading (as LR seems to recognise).

Cheers

**blackrangie** · 23rd April 2019, 08:46 AM

Originally Posted by ozscott

If Lucky8 are right (see all of thr discussion above about D5 style coolers in the front skirt area...) means it is not correct to say that putting them.their is OK for offroading (as LR seems to recognise).

Cheers

Good point, however lucky 8 have been "bashing" their Discovery 5 around for a few years now and haven't reported any issues, infact we havent heard of any issues worldwide even with just the standard bumper(the approach is very good in high mode so it does sit high and back)... but props to Land Rover if they are taking extra precaution with the defender knowing the end use a will be more predominantly dual use.

The ingenium engines I'm not sure if we will get the petrol version in Australia as previously discussed our fuel quality is not at the standard needed yet. However this is no confirmed.

Anyone have any ideas why they would have an engine bay shot?

DiscoMick · 23rd April 2019, 10:53 AM

I was assuming they had TC as wheels spun briefly then stopped. LR has very good TC now.

**blackrangie** · 23rd April 2019, 10:53 AM

Hey guys finally found this photo of the coil Range Rover Sport defender mule.

Interesting things are the rear tow mount, brake size front and rear, and coil springs.

Land Rover Defender prototype spy shots - Autoblog

Spy Shots—Land Rover Defender Mule

**blackrangie** · 23rd April 2019, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

I was assuming they had TC as wheels spun briefly then stopped. LR has very good TC now.

Yes I'm not sure how the traction control works in conjunction with e lockers that are available as a rear option on the newer LR's.

I'm guessing if the traction control can't get you up Stage 2 would be really Locker engaging.

**scarry** · 23rd April 2019, 03:33 PM

Actually the E locker on the D4 works on the black top at times.

If you watch it on the Gap tool,it loads up at various times,depending on acceleration,cornering,etc.

IT appears to be infinitely variable.

Gordon from GOE commented on here,a while ago, that the TC on the last of the D4's was that good, the E locker didn't make a lot of difference.Also a late model D4 with no E locker was almost as good in the rough stuff as a D3 with E locker,thats how much the TC had improved.

So no doubt the new Deefer will have the latest and best TC available.
Whether it has an E locker,front,rear,or both,who knows.

Looking at those vids, TC can be seen working.

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