Won’t be retro...

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Originally Posted by blackrangie

Hey, allready discussed above, this is why Low Range and AirSusp is an option in AU, grey nomads come to mind + any commercial applications.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/l660-defe...st2913084.html

Why pay for something you dont need. [emoji41]

Its like a builder saying you have to have a pool and a diving board when quoting you a house even though you are a paraplegic and will never use the pool. You would find another builder.

People would complain if LR didn't have coil option, and also if they do.

New defender will no doubt based on mules have coil option, people will probs whinge about that too. [emoji1787]

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Most Paraplegics want the pool. Just with hoist and ramp access...

Cheers

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Originally Posted by blackrangie

Remember inflation adds approx 10k every 10years

For example a 65k car in 2009 would be priced the same at 75k in 2019

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Yeah but the pricing increase in the D5 is not only due to inflation.

Top of the line D4 V8 came with every single option available as standard @ 130K, there was nothing else you could tick on the options list.

As an example, on carsales now there is a HSE SDV6 D5 for 146K (and that's main event pricing). It does not include ediff, top line sound, surround cameras, windsor leather etc etc.

Unquestionably at those prices, people with go to the RRS instead of the D5 if they don't need the space the d5 offers.

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Originally Posted by ozscott

Inflation has been low. Haven't fact checked that but it doesn't come anywhere near the 30k difference. If someone bought a d4 and then wants to upgrade to the same basic spec on and off-road it's a $30k increase...about the cost of a nice Mazda 3.

Cheers

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Still 10k every 10 years

Inflation Calculator | RBA

2015 discovery where not cheap last time i checked

D5 starting price seems fair considering what it now has and how much the competition in that class is imo

Ok mate

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Originally Posted by scarry

Correct,I can’t see the value at all.Its all the add ons that is rediculous

Then there is the depreciation,at least 10K a year for the first 5 yrs.In reality probably more depending on Ks.

As I have said,it’s designed for a different market than any other Disco,as LR have said,to make way for the new Deefer.

We seem to be parrots here,keep repeating same old.[biggrin]

Those that want one,great,grab one,but for me no way,it’s not the type of vehicle I want.

As for BLackies comment about more accessories coming for it as time goes on,I doubt it.

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New Developments - Rhino4x4

They mentioned a few months back when i enquired they had the car scanning done.

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Originally Posted by SBD4

You missed the point here, this was written in response to you posting a D5 vehicle configuration that was supposedly cheap as an example of what might be achievable for the new Defender which, in the context of the conversation has been about something that is relatively affordable and off road capable etc.



I have no issue with making things like air suspension and dual transfer case optional, the issue is that to get those things you are required to upgrade the engine as well from the SD4 to the TD6 which makes it a far more expensive exercise to get what you want. LRA make you pay for stuff you don't want to get the stuff you do want. This just one example of how LRA bundle features together in "packs" which can be quite expensive. Not only that they will split desirable features up into separate packs so that a buyer will be forced to get both packs to get the features they want. Not only that, many of these features are standard on other brands but you are forced to pay for them on a LR.

The point being that the cool off road gizmos will likely be options that will force the price up making the vehicle expensive and out of reach of those that want to use it for what it is designed for thus limiting it's potential market.

Regarding your mention of grey nomads... if they are towing heavy loads they need low range, not for highway towing, but for maneuvering. Any conditions that require low speed maneuvering (esp. reversing) for any length of time will risk the auto trans overheating (not to mention the finer control you have of the accelerator with LR).



I think I can get what you're saying without the simplistic analogy[bigwhistle][wink11]



Yep, you're right, people will complain. Just like Abraham Lincoln said, "You can please some of the people..." you know the rest, but I'm not one of those folk. As someone who has bought 3 new late model vehicles form LR I think I am well placed to make comment on the sales and marketing strategies of LRA. I love the brand, but LRA really do bend you over with the way they structure the pricing along with limiting how AUS vehicles are configured for the luxury sector.

There are people that would love to have a D5 but to get what they NEED it becomes too expensive and they go elsewhere. To build market share LRA need to cater to the lower end of the market so people can get their foot in the door and experience the brand.

Ultimately, I am just saying that I hope they don't take the same approach with the Defender.

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Fair points, I agree you should be able to choose in any engine, hopefully they get that right with the new defender, then again i would always recommend someone to buy a disco with air susp.

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Originally Posted by blackrangie

Still 10k every 10 years

Inflation Calculator | RBA

2015 discovery where not cheap last time i checked

D5 starting price seems fair considering what it now has and how much the competition in that class is imo

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While consumer price inflation has been positive, the motor vehicles component of the ABS Consumer Price Index (CPI) has actually been going backwards since the mid-1990s. Cars are cheaper than they used to be.

Attachment 151445

2020 Land Rover Defender to go mainstream - motoring.com.au

Multiple shots fired.

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“When you see our announcements around this car, you will see it will be a very wide, stretched range. We will compete with some of the volume manufacturers but we will also go up to very powerful, very luxurious versions of the Defender.

“We will have a range that will span to cater to many different people, just like our competitors’ products. Toyota’s LandCruiser is not dissimilar.”

“Couple that with our historic love of older incarnations of Defender – which was very much a heart rather than a head product … I think we’ve got to take that positivity and opportunity and bring something that’s going to be thoroughly modern as well.”

Cameron’s definition of “thoroughly modern” will include safety provisions. Recent off-road releases such as the Suzuki Jimny (three-star) and Jeep Wrangler (one-star) haven’t been kindly received by crash-testing authorities.

Land Rover plans to do things differently.

“We have to have a car that is capable of doing incredible things off road but also has the comfort and refinement of a Land Rover and meet an acceptable level of safety for pedestrians, drivers and occupants,” he said.

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Jeep Wrangler Once Again Earns Dismal Crash-test Rating Using Euro-based Metrics - The Truth About Cars

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Originally Posted by phin

While consumer price inflation has been positive, the motor vehicles component of the ABS Consumer Price Index (CPI) has actually been going backwards since the mid-1990s. Cars are cheaper than they used to be.

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Landys and cruisers,patrols etc seem to be going up in price every year from what i have seen, maybe some small family sedans are cheaper?

Range Rover was 7k in 1970

Range Rover in 2019 is getting close to 400k in top trim.

7k in 1970 is 81k now.

...

According to redbook

95 top of line cruiser 73k

2019 top of line cruiser 120k

95 disco top of line 67k

2019 disco top of line 125k

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Originally Posted by blackrangie

Landys and cruisers,patrols etc seem to be going up in price every year from what i have seen, maybe some small family sedans are cheaper?

Range Rover was 7k in 1970

Range Rover in 2019 is getting close to 400k in top trim.

7k in 1970 is 81k now.

...

According to redbook

95 top of line cruiser 73k

2019 top of line cruiser 120k

95 disco top of line 67k

2019 disco top of line 125k

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Some vehicles have increased in price much more than others, even within the 4wd class. A Defender 110 wagon went from $38,033 in 2000 to $47,500 in 2016. A Suzuki Jimny manual went from $19,990 in 2000 to $23,990 in 2019. On the other hand a single cab 79 series went from $45,750 in 2000 to $58,990 in 2016. Why anyone would buy the new SWB Defender as a proper 4wd when you can get the new 2019 Jimny for $24k plus on-roads is beyond me, but that's another story...

But it's easy to cherry pick red-book values to get suit either your or my argument. My point is that based on official data, inflation for motor vehicles overall has been negative since the mid-1990s.

cheers Phin