Won’t be retro...

**blackrangie** · 25th March 2019, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by scarry

FWIW,there is very little LR bashing on Yota forums.

Unless i am looking on the wrong ones?

On some sites there is a bit of Yota bashing....

In fact on the 76 owners Yota FB site,i have never ever seen any LR bashing,ever,and i have been on it for ages.

They are a good mob of guys,younger than many on here,that generally keep on topic all the time,with lots of good info,not only about Yotas,but about heaps other things as well.Similar as here(but without any LR stuff).

Good to know and i should hope that we also have a similar reputation, my point was, here is not the place for LR bashing, and yes there is a lot mainly from people that think anything that has even a slight bit of aerodynamics in the panels and anything above a vinyl bench seat with a stick cannot possibly be a good 4x4.

We should have our opinions for sure, however at the same time we should respect each others brands, and even within the brand other peoples choices and needs.

Some may need a kluger and that's perfect for them and good on em. Likewise some may feel the Evoque is the choice for them, like a nice elderly gentleman I met that uses it for solo van towing and light touring and swears by it.

Others may feel the old defender is the bees knees or a series 1, still others a RRV, RRS or a D5.

Point is everyone's needs from a 4x4 or SUV are different and should be respected.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder they say and one mans trash is another's treasure.

Lets keep this thread and this forum respectful both of each others 4x4 choice and most importantly respectfull to eachother as per forum requirements.

**Zeros** · 25th March 2019, 09:00 PM

Originally Posted by rar110

I don’t think the new Defender will be truck like rugged as is the previous defender or G. But will be a cross between a Hilux ruggedness, D4 appeal, with Defender appearance cues. Apart from appearance cues there won’t me much in common with the last edition (which I think was a BT50/Ranger parts bin edition and not respectful of the vehicle’s heritage

).

I think it will have more appeal than a G, D4 or a Hilux, if JLR can shake its unreliability/QA reputation at least for this model.

I think you’re right in terms of D4 appeal and being lighter duty. It’s a shame though that the D5 couldn’t be that, with the Defender being reborn as a new heavy duty truck for the work market. Yet to be fully seen of course but it looks like that’s the way it’s going.

Disagree re last Defender being a Ford parts bin edition though. It’s still 100% Defender other than an engine/gearbox combo that is proven worldwide and makes the last classic Defender a much more refined machine, while retaining it’s no nonsense robust ability and character. The only real fault is lack of grease on the adapter shaft and a weaker TC centre. Once fixed, there are many positives to outweigh these negatives IMO.

**Zeros** · 25th March 2019, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by blackrangie

Defenders have always been aimed at people that go offroad no mater where they live, the new defender will be no different.

JLR are far from silly to bring the defender into the 21st century.

Discovery 5 is currently the best ALL terrain 4x4, the "Golden Goose" as you call it.

YouTube

YouTube

(D5 at the ring on winter tyres)

The new defender from what i have seen so far will take the title even though the D5 is an incredibly hard act to follow.

You should buy a D5 Blackrangie. By the time the new Defender arrives in OZ your 2019 D5 will be coming to the end of its warranty / roadside assist period and ready to trade in.

**blackrangie** · 25th March 2019, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by rar110

I don’t think the new Defender will be truck like rugged as is the previous defender or G. But will be a cross between a Hilux ruggedness, D4 appeal, with Defender appearance cues. Apart from appearance cues there won’t me much in common with the last edition (which I think was a BT50/Ranger parts bin edition and not respectful of the vehicle’s heritage

).

I think it will have more appeal than a G, D4 or a Hilux, if JLR can shake its unreliability/QA reputation at least for this model.

Agreed I think it would be very hard to keep the same level of ruggedness of the current defender and at the same time fix its comfort, tech and safety issues.

Im guessing your talking about the Gwagon professional, the current 2019 G wagon is anything but rugged inside.(AMG version even less again (pic)

Agree with your take to a degree, Hilux does have a modern ruggedness about it however if you compare the leaked New Defender shot with a Hilux dash, the ND (at this stage) seems to up the game with a more rugged and utilitarian dash in comparison , D4 appeal maybe but dash wheelbase, seats etc fairly different, its looking like 6 seats unless they do a 130 with 8 aswell.

I think interior wise somewhere between a Rivian ,gwagon professional and a Hilux interior minus the centre consoles on all 3 and add a middle seat

Agreed will keep defender appearance cues, all doors + wheelbases and rear spare allready leading towards that, padding on bonnet and roof will no doubt reveal modernized rounder defender styling.

Will be somewhat more rounded to bring it up to date and for fuel efficiency as was the case with the D5, The D5 reduced its the drag coefficient by 70 counts from the D4, down to CD=0.33.
When you look into the science of fuel efficiency, boxy designs just don't cut it in a world where fuel efficiency is everything, especially in Europe.

(PDF) The aerodynamics development of the New Land Rover Discovery

People say the D5 has gone soft(due to its looks), its far from true, its more capable and more practical then the D4, its modern lines and full aero design, plus its 500kg weight loss help it get 7.4L to 100kms, but still enable 8.3sec to 100kph with no reduction in off-road capability.

Now the old defender used double the fuel, had half the power and took twice as long to get to 100kph.

Bring on the ND hopefully it has similar figures to the D5, considering it should be a little lighter(less seats and shorter). Yes it will be a little rounder than the old Defender, but for good reason and the reason is not just to appeal to a larger market.

Pics Gwagon, Hilux, Gwagon pro, new defender(Google it)

**blackrangie** · 25th March 2019, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by Zeros

You should buy a D5 Blackrangie. By the time the new Defender arrives in OZ your 2019 D5 will be coming to the end of its warranty / roadside assist period and ready to trade in.

Its tempting but with 5 year warranty and 5 year servicing(and I'm guessing 5 years roadside) at the moment being offered your timings off haha. Hear there is a wait for the D5s ATM, Customers will have their defenders next year according to JLR.
Im happy to wait, if i had known how good they where in 2017 I may very well have, in the meantime ill enjoy my RRC

**blackrangie** · 25th March 2019, 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by Zeros

Disagree re last Defender being a Ford parts bin edition though. It’s still 100% Defender other than an engine/gearbox combo that is proven worldwide and makes the last classic Defender a much more refined machine, while retaining it’s no nonsense robust ability and character. The only real fault is lack of grease on the adapter shaft and a weaker TC centre. Once fixed, there are many positives to outweigh these negatives IMO.

Agreed, My mate just got this fix in his puma defender, now has a grease nipple, says its a much smoother transfer now also.

**Zeros** · 26th March 2019, 04:18 AM

Originally Posted by blackrangie

Its tempting but with 5 year warranty and 5 year servicing(and I'm guessing 5 years roadside) at the moment being offered your timings off haha. Hear there is a wait for the D5s ATM, Customers will have their defenders next year according to JLR.
Im happy to wait, if i had known how good they where in 2017 I may very well have, in the meantime ill enjoy my RRC

I’d be surprised if Australia gets many of the first Defenders in 2020. The 2022/3 model will have bugs ironed out anyway ...and if you follow the 5 year ‘free’ scheduled disco servicing you’d want to trade it in after 3/4 anyway because it will probably only have had about two oil changes by then!

**rar110** · 26th March 2019, 08:07 AM

Yes I was referring to the G Professional.

**blackrangie** · 26th March 2019, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Zeros

I’d be surprised if Australia gets many of the first Defenders in 2020. The 2022/3 model will have bugs ironed out anyway ...and if you follow the 5 year ‘free’ scheduled disco servicing you’d want to trade it in after 3/4 anyway because it will probably only have had about two oil changes by then!

Haha comon try to say something positive about a new LR, you can do it

You have to admit 5year warranty, Free 5 year servicing and free roadside assistance (they helped one member to the tune of 30k)is not a bad thing. Hmm

What facts led you to believe we won't get many?

The recommended service schedule is fine for normal driving, if your offroading in water, mud, dust lots like any 4x4 you would up the oil changes and pay for extra.

There will be minor software bugs, however as we have seen in this thread, LR now extensivly endurance test vehicles before they leave the factories for reliability,then they undertake hundreds of thousands of Kms of real world testing both on/off road for that very reason the whole time, sending data back to H/O to tweak software and give feedback on components etc, its not in any way like your rolling the dice these days, look at the D5, did the universe open up and swallow it?

Software updates are pretty easy these days happens all the time on our phones (bug sorting) new cars are the same, some over the air, others happen at service time.

First models of succesfull vehicles are valuable and collectables, according to my dealer and another I spoke to, many already have their name down for refundable preorders (this means you get guaranteed build slot) and also determins how many extra Defenders the dealers get.

But yep, the people that miss out on those 2 scenarios will have to wait, and that's fine, everyone's different.

**Zeros** · 26th March 2019, 08:53 AM

Mate you’ve changed your post to: “Haha comon try to say something positive about a new LR, you can do it

“

OK, all new model Land Rovers are brilliant SUV’s for the urban adventure market. Class leading. Brilliant tech. I wish I could afford a Velar as well as my Defender.

...Previously your post said, “Was someone saying something about LR bashing?” ...I think that was only you.

There’s a big difference between constructive critique / reality checking and ‘bashing’. Disagreeing is not bashing. Discussing disappointment that the new Defender looks to be more of a D4 than a Defender is not bashing.

This thread is about the new Defender, which has always been a heavy duty work truck, not what the D5 should have been, which seems to be where it’s heading.

Endless fanboy promo without any critique is just not real. Countering some of it only feels like bashing in the face of the constant advertising spin.

Based on my personal experience and reading many others, dealer servicing is very hit and miss and as I’ve already said, it’s not ‘free’.

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