Thread: The New Defender

Originally Posted by 460cixy

There is nothing commercial about this vehicle as close as it will come to commercial is to be on a TV commercial

Nice joke , to be fair you fail to show any facts to back up your claim, as soon as you used the word nothing, to me that's unreasonable. There is plenty commercial about the commercial defender just as there is with the commercial prado for example.
The discovery 5 even has a commercial version and is used by many governments and organisations around the world in very commercial ways.

There are many commercial businesses the commercial defender and even the normal Defender would be fine for, at the same time there are many other businesses that it would not work for.

Originally Posted by Tombie

We have never seen a commercial in AU so don’t hold out for it.

Didn't we read on one of these threads that Land Rover Australia are on record saying they are ordering a few for evaluation as soon as they're available?

Originally Posted by blackrangie

.... around 70percent of the tradies i know socially run vans for work, space/security. ....

Currently, I know 2.
both brothers in laws.

One chippie runs a 20+ yo MB140.
Asked him why, and not a ute-tray-chassis vehicle ... as said security and can't be bothered to unload every night/morning.
And a large van like a sprinter or trafic hold a ton more stuff, and more importantly keeps the stuff dry(eg. plaster)

Other one is an elec has had 3 utes with bodies, and he's spent more on the various body on the back than it'd have cost him to just be smart and get a van to begin with.
Nice chap, but not the smartest cookie, and occasionally needs to run a trailer too. He's more than capable to build his own storage system .. just the typical mindset of the regular joe tradie .. they all seem to use utes .. so utes must be better!

I also went through it (when I was a courier) thinking that a ute may net me more $s at work. It kind'a did, but overall not.
I used to be an express courier, not the DHL/Toll/Couriers please type, where you'd get a run with a load of stuff and so on.
Mine was get a job(or two or three) and go .. express service, basically ASAP.
I used to notice when I was a motorbike courier that the ute guys used to get some good work because sometimes they'd get a tray job(eg. a pallet) and jobs would be allocated in grouped areas. So some other good(high paying) jobs would go with the tray work too.
After my accident, had to continue in a car vehicle, ended up deciding a ute(dual cab) was the way to go. WRONG!
While the tray job paid well for the job itself, they all ended up being hand unloading .. takes time to deliver 80 cartons up 20 flights of stairs .. say an hour. While you got paid for the unload, it wasn't worth the $ per hour compared to missing out on the rest of the work coming and going in that time .. so the reality was that the benefit of easy pallet loading and higher paying initial work in fact wasn't.
Later we got a brilliant customer that required medical deliveries to hospitals, and needed to be both enclosed and secure .. no way to do easy on a tray/ute .. so missed out on heaps of very high paying work whilst I had the Rodeo.
Ended up pinching dads Frontera(wagon) and started to get a lot of this medical work(as they were based 30sec around the corner form my house!

Utes look macho/tough/whatever .. vans far more practical in 'every day'(ie. 90% of the work that commercial vehicles need to do.

Not saying that utes(or trays) aren't useful, they obviously are . eg. a crane job can usually only be done off a tray/ute sometimes .. but sometimes workarounds can be had .. but how many ute drivers can really say their work involves crane lifts?

I can't imagine a commerical Defer sold here. Never say never tho. .. eg, if they can strip it to a point where it comes under the luxury tax limit or something.

In some European countries it works due to tax breaks. I sometimes watch a Youtuber called Tirsbaek(or similar) they sometimes elaborate. Very specific regs tho .. No of seats, cage behind driver .. etc. But they save many thousands of their currencies in road tax and purchase price .. hence why they exist over there.

Of the vans I've driven: old AB(I think) 120 Inter. Bedford, old(80's) transits .. all of which you wouldn't wish on your worst enemy. Trying to keep it on the straight and narrow was a harder then the loading/unloading.
Toyota Hiace bus(no seats, for general deliveries) .. most unreliable vehicle ever known. Had some fuel issue(dunno), and everything fuel related was renewed on it. Nice to drive(quietish when loaded) just would stop on 'ya for no reason, yet no mechanic could figure it out.
These weren't mine, just driven for friends family work.
Had brothers Mazda E1600(SW .. another horrid vehicle, in a dynamic sense. When unloaded would snap it's rear end out at the slightest chance of the teeniest bump in a road. And once got 'bogged' in a paved downhill driveway, simply because I went in nose first not realising no where to turn to get back out. Had to call a towie to pull it out. Otherwise OK to drive.

Best vans were the independently sprung Hiace(first models in the early 90's .. very nice. Better than my Falcon at the time. And those W series Mitsis, also drove nice.
Last vans I've driven.. late model Transits and a super long wheelbase Trafic. 2.5t, 3 pallet load for a piddly 4 cyl motor pulled quite OK. nice and smooth too.

As an example of where I could imagine a commercial stripped out cheapest > $65K Defer could be of some value could be to farmers or any outback/horrid road commercial environment.
Having a vehicle that doesn't buck and kick at ya for hours on end on a typical Aussie back road .. just makes for less fatiguing day.

On tradies and Utes, had to laugh.

Dropped into ARB in Adelaide the other day to see a mate and there was a shiny new Raptor out the front.

Turns out its a tradie, and it was in to try and get a canopy, and a suspension upgrade - they have Bypass Coil over set ups.

Seems they are buying them for the "Cool Kid" factor and then realising they are downrated for the suspension package they have and dont suit the role as a tradie work vehicle.

Apparently theres been a lot of them! at +$80k thats a big stuff up and a lot of coin for a show pony Yes they are great when used for intended purpose eg. quick lightly loaded runs out bush. But hopeless for all other purposes.

Originally Posted by 100inch

I will never understand the discussion about moving the 'average' Toyota (and 'similar' brands) driver over to JLR. Do I really want the average speeding, tail gating Hilux/ LC200 (particular WA) owner driving a new Defender? Nope.
Many of my close friends drive Toyota's for commercial or geographical reasons but for the Greater Melbourne Area I am happy to pay premium and let pricing do the selection. m

Nice idea, but JLR need to attract new buyers, to get a solid return on their huge R&D investment in the new Defender.

There’s no commercial/growth benefit in attracting buyers who would have bought a D5 or to achieve the same average sales numbers as the ‘Defender Classic’.

So far it seems the Pretender will not make it as a van, ute, or a camper. It is a capable SUV that can tow, but there are a ton of those on offer already - including discovery and range rover.

It has to be said, in terms of versatility and potential for commercial application, this new hippo offers very little when compared to the Defender.

It has been said by some on here that the market wouldnt support a utility variant and that it would have cost too much to develop for the return. But if LR were truly innovative they would have designed a new defender platform that was modular, so that it could be easily adapted to various configurations including chassis back.

I'm still hoping LR have a few tricks up their sleeve with the 130. Maybe then it won't pain me to call it the new Defender.

AK83
Everyone has a bias by design of personal experience
Yours defines commercial work as city based trade/courier/commercial and I totally understand that

It’s just not everyone has work to do that a Van is the right choice

Next time I need a half cube of pre-mix driven across three paddocks I’ll just back the Mrs SUV up and have the bobcat driver shovel it in the back by hand! Or I could just get a load in the tray

Or how about loading up a cement mixer! I’d love to see that squeeze in the back of a 110

Or a bail of hay

Or ......



There really is a need for utes over and above tradies in go fast rangers on silly fat tyres!!!


I’ve loved both my 130 DC
My first went to a cattle property on southern cape York after I bought the new one - it flogs about doing farm work in a way that a van just wouldn’t


Myself and others like me are obviously upset that LR have chosen to build another SUV rather than a vehicle that can be both a wagon and a Ute.

Anyways, as you say they will do what they choose - small time customers like farmers / forestry etc just count for zero in their planning.

S

Originally Posted by rar110

Nice idea, but JLR need to attract new buyers, to get a solid return on their huge R&D investment in the new Defender.

There’s no commercial/growth benefit in attracting buyers who would have bought a D5 or to achieve the same average sales numbers as the ‘Defender Classic’.

Agree with what you say but JLR has no interest to join big fleet rebate structures and that is including Army fleet (not SVO type) contracts. This is also to protect future values and the brand. Yes, they have to sell volume but not at every price. There is a reason brands like Toyota and Nissan trying to establish 'premium' brands with more or less success. Future will tell. m