Thread: What are the pros and cons Defender v Puma v Disco3/4

Originally Posted by P38ace

Getting away from the original post here but to try and answer the above concisely;

Stats are derived from facts. JD Power is a world leader in stats and is therefore well worth a read. The stats are derived from owner feedback.

Owners of all marques are asked the same questions and "Study results are tabulated using a “problems per 100 vehicles (PP100)” metric"

2010 Initial Quality Study Results | J.D. Power

Various studies are undertaken including initial quality (first 90 days) and dependability (3 years). It is not reliability which is studied (that's very subjective) but overall owner satisfaction.

Manufacturers certainly take notice of the results tables and for good reason, they are their paying customers opinion.

The worrying thing about LR's latest models is that the faults largely seem to be completely random failings so you never quite know what's going to go next. At lease with the Japs the faults seem to be consistent, and deemed to be design features !!!

I think you are answering my own point, but you're not getting what my concern is......"derived from facts" The facts are there, you don't need to fabricate an outcome....although many do. It's what you do with those facts that is the issue and the question. How you 'tabulate' them? What really is owner satisfaction? It's like asking people "what is taste....in wine and music, etc"....it's so subjective. If it wasn't there would be a whole lot of cars that never sell!

Any owner of anything is going to be dissatisfied with stuff going wrong...anything at all. Have never said otherwise. The whole point of this thread is what car would you buy....Deefer, D series or otherwise. If you were looking for a car that produces nothing on a survey radar you probably wouldn't look at LR, or Nissan or BMW or Toyota....or...or....or.....so then it becomes a question of which one of these things are important issues. In other words, most people on this site are savvy enough to know that there will be issues if they buy a LR but if they want a car that will do the business, they are going to have to live with certain concerns......blown engines, transmissions, ****e off-road performance is not going to be one of them....well not from what I've read on D3/4/RRS! They have looked through the pros and cons and have purchased on that basis. I'm certain Deefer drivers have too.

And I shouldn't have mentioned 'That's why they keep selling'....that means nothing....marketing sells stuff. Manufacturers spend Brazillian $s to make that happen. You can have the best product in the world and a bad selling campaign will kill it....and vice versa. How many crap products are sold on a good hype.....?????

Am I ****ed about broken light fittings in my D4 and squeaky rubber in the suspension....damn right I am......but would I write it off as unrelliable and unable to perform......no chance!

That's my only point really.

P.S. and as PAT 303 stated...... So yes it would be interesting to see the fidelity of the next round of JD reports....as Toyos are now becoming more renown for concerns more than V8 diesels that drink more oil than a jet engine does AVTUR and blow other numerous 'serious' components.....

Mate, technically I'm not disagreeing with most that you say....it's just what is important with those facts, is often diluted or lost!


Completely random faults?.....dunno..........can't see the pattern.....LOL. ;-)

Hello Captain,

PM or email me, I can give you contact details of a customer with a Mulgo pop top on a puma Defender.

Cheers,
Daniel