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Hydrogen is a scam, same as the idea of methane as a "transition fuel." The companies pushing it just want to delay the move to electric because they've got decades long supply chain contracts for ICE drivetrain components.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homestar
Will agree to disagree - I think EV's are not the magic bullet some seem to think they are only part of a larger mix of technologies we'll need in the future - Agriculture, Trucking, Mining, Mobile Power Generation, etc - even your trip to Dingo **** Creek towing your 3.5 tonne acoustically transparent ****ter will never be able to go electric so something needs to be developed to fill this gap if we are even to be rid of fossil fuels. If you're sitting on some magic tech that can do this then I'm all ears, but batteries isn't it. I don't want to hear the catch cry of the great EV washed which is 'Future battery tech will solve this' as that's fantasy land - all the BS you see on magic new batteries never comes to anything because it's all a con job - listen to the Chemists and they'll tell you that from here on battery tech will just be a bit of fluffing around the edges because the science tells us that we're pretty much at the top end regarding energy density. These are call facts and is backed by Science, not your mate down the pub who saw a great article on line about 'the next big thing in batteries' - I know it's inconvenient and you don't have to like them but it doesn't change them.
Using wind and solar energy to produce Hydrogen seems a logical step in the right direction. Yes, it's years away, but you have to start somewhere. Is it green at the moment - no, not even close, but it will have to go that way at some point even if that pushed the price of the fuel up.
There's a reason a lot of equipment manufacturers are looking at and starting to produce Hydrogen prototypes - because they know as well as anyone that batteries won't and can't do what is required so are looking at alternatives. Calling Hydrogen a scam gives them no credit for what they are trying - and it's not the Hydrogen suppliers that are doing this, its almost every global OEM from trucking to agriculture to construction equipment, etc - it's everywhere you look. A hydrogen generator (Toyota Fuel Cell) has just gone into a construction site around the corner from us - how do you do that with a battery? - The tech is coming and will play an important role, just like EV's will.
no worries, every scam has people who buy into it. That's how scams work.
Just like EV's? [bigwhistle]Quote:
Originally Posted by akelly
what's the scam with EVs? There are thousands of them on the road and more every day. Show me all the hydrogen cars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homestar
While not many of them are on the road at the moment there are few hydrogen cell cars on the road in Qld, ACT and Vic. The ACT ones are totally green - not sure about the others.
a tiny number, basically a front for toyota because they failed to invest in pure EVs. Government fleets pushed out at a loss to pretend its viable. You fellas can believe what you want, but hydrogen is a scam that's already been eclipsed by an actual real-world technology with millions of on-road miles under it's belt. When you're driving one let me know.Quote:
Originally Posted by 101RRS
Weren't Hyundai one of the players in the ACT?Quote:
Originally Posted by akelly
Noticed Toyota doing the wait a few years and look at me! Diversified powertrains are Toyota’s long-term answerQuote:
Originally Posted by Homestar
Contemplating a Hilux BEV for Australia, Hanley said we must comprehend the size, weight and charging time of the battery pack required to achieve a range of 800km – as you’d get from a diesel HiLux.
“Rest assured, Toyota is working on it,” Hanley said, citing Toyota’s work on solid state batteries as a solution. That, or how hydrogen fuel cells could come into their own.
Toyota brings electric Hilux prototype to Australia with modest range and capability - Chasing Cars
My mates in Perth Poo to Hydrogen via hydrogen pyrolysis at any scale and likely to be 7 times cheaper than Wind/Solar to Hydrogen electrolysis I think. The main reason is the cheap power can be used far more effectively at a far higher ROI for the other power demand any anyone thinking just replacing existing power demand is enough is far more optimistic than rational.
Excuse me if I am waffling here! A place with 95% hydro power can sell that cheap power for more money to others on the network all the way from Québec to Texas is a great case study.
Hydro‑Québec can make so much more selling its abundant hydro power to others that is seriously looking to restart Nuclear power to meet Québecs own power needs so it can meet the supply contracts others are signing up for. Sound crazy? Its pure economics at work I think.
[thumbsupbig][thumbsupbig] Have a great day
Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyDiver
apart from the fact you seem to be having a stroke, you don't seem to understand energy or economics at all.