EV general discussion

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Originally Posted by Tombie

The UN and the WHO are two of the most corrupt organisations on earth, their agendas do not serve the average people of this planet. Their policies do not serve the greater good. They serve greater profit.

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This is the most relevant statement posted, in this discussion.

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Originally Posted by Saitch

You've got the terminology correct, at least. "Act"!

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You're right for some it is a local "act". My neighbours have a large "Climate Action Now" sign in their front window, however they both drive ICE cars, but his parents have one maybe two electric ones, so he might think he can claim credit for that. They have no solar, although they put in a small rain water tank, but I think that was for a vegetable garden that turned into weeds.

Not in my case as I have solar hot water, 5kW of solar power (has generated 100MW/h), a rainwater and grey water system. I've had the green bin pretty much since it started at least 10 years ago, and feel vindicated that Brisbane is rolling it out to all residents to prevent lawn clippings, leaves, branches, etc going in the red bins to landfill a total waste.

I wish some of these systems were larger, and that I'd thought of some of this before building began. I only put the solar hot water on the house when it was being built, because I asked my engineer mate what would be easier to install then rather than later.

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Originally Posted by RANDLOVER

You're right for some it is a local "act". My neighbours have a large "Climate Action Now" sign in their front window, however they both drive ICE cars, but his parents have one maybe two electric ones, so he might think he can claim credit for that. They have no solar, although they put in a small rain water tank, but I think that was for a vegetable garden that turned into weeds.

Not in my case as I have solar hot water, 5kW of solar power (has generated 100MW/h), a rainwater and grey water system. I've had the green bin pretty much since it started at least 10 years ago, and feel vindicated that Brisbane is rolling it out to all residents to prevent lawn clippings, leaves, branches, etc going in the red bins to landfill a total waste.

I wish some of these systems were larger, and that I'd thought of some of this before building began. I only put the solar hot water on the house when it was being built, because I asked my engineer mate what would be easier to install then rather than later.

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So because you have more money to throw away and green stupidity, you are better?? Lets all cheer for you .. you are so much better than your neighbours :TakeABow:

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Originally Posted by Tombie

I think we both agree an urban/metro application is the prime case for EVs.

Less exhaust in congested/built up environs is a good thing.



Beyond that? they are not a solution to the woes of our leaders who believe it will save the planet - they will be, if pushed to be the prime mode of propulsion, quite the opposite.

Watching the tech evolution is interesting as each company races to cash in (and that's the key drivers - industry and economic).

Either way, you cannot reduce emissions overall by wrecking areas of the planet, all whilst allowing ongoing population growth?


TLDR;

Even a very very simple example based on predicted human population growth shows we're on the wrong path:-

Assuming each human emits an average of 10% ?carbons?

Currently:
10% of 8.1 billion is 800 million ?carbons?

Back in 1985 when this sort of started
10% of 4.8 billion was 480 million ?carbons?

Based on predictions of 2050 population
9.7 billion we have 970 million ?carbons? to deal with.

That would require each human to reduce their footprint by 2% to 8%

Even then we still wouldn't reach parity as those extra 1.6 billion people will consume more industries and resources.

The proposed plan is a lot bigger than stifling industry all whilst increasing cost of living exponentially.

EVs cannot prevent this.


Any Person on the land will tell you, you don't over stock your resources. Else you decimate your land. The Earth is just a large ball of land, without attempts to manage it in a similar manner - the result of metaphorical over grazing - is inevitable.

Yikes!!!

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No this won't happen. by 2050, we won't really care about the mighty $$$C02$$$ and how many $$$ we can con out of people to "save the world". The biggest issue facing man kind will be our birthrate. Each generation is having less kids, once we start down this path it isn't linear. The population will drop off a cliff face. If the first generation has less kids, and the following generation has slightly less kids again. Its not a straight line in population reduction. As the 2nd ... 3rd ... 4th generation has less people in the first instance also having less kids. It will be a terrifying time for them. everything will be about encouraging people to have children again.

We will care about the massively aging population. I've read we are probably close to "peak" population right now. As soon as countries are lifted out of poverty they stop having kids at replacement rate. So as the 3rd world can feed itself ... suddenly the world population will plummet. The only reason we have population growth in australia is immigration (same for every 1st world country).

Net Zero is just lunacy ... insanity. Most of these nutters don't even know how much C02 is even in the air. Ask the next brainwashed fruitloop that goes on with it. You will get an answer like "maybe 30% of air is C02". To save the net zero lunies looking it up, it is 0.039% of the air. The loony net zero targets are almost meaningless when you look at the percentage of difference they are talking.

seeya
Shane L.

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Originally Posted by DoubleChevron

Yes, and there stupidity will be ignore by all but the brain washed. Now you just touched on the other obvious thing EV's do, they are trying to take cars out of the hands of poor poeple. So "make people other than me drive less". You are doing a very good job telling us what WE should do is a way that sounds like you're not.
ie:

• do what we say
• buy what we say
• you don't need a car
• if you can somehow afford one, you must buy the one we tell you
• If I put luny net zero here, our expectation is you will be living in a cave with no power or heating and be happy for it as you are saving the planet.

This is one of the most fascinating talks I've seen on EVs .... I know you won't watch it as net zero/ev evangelists refuse to even listen to anything that will not match there beliefs. However this isn't anti EV.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8Nz...NvbGxlZ2UgZXYg

It is really fascinating. I had no idea the horse and cart was so expensive.

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Ok.. I watched the video. He's a good speaker that's for sure. I wouldn't want to end up in a debate with him.

But he said straight up "I used to be a mechanic.. I like gas cars.. I don't like EV's". There were lots of "facts" which were at best dubious, and at worst deliberately deceptive.

And as per much in this thread it was a lot of "That's all just @#$T .. I don't like it. It's not going to work". But there are no actual answers or alternative plans. In summary, haters gonna hate. It's a democracy, and in the current climate in the US I suspect he's angling for a job. We must remember this is about the US, not Australia.Personally I think what the previous administration was doing was really going the right way. The US is going to regret the decision to pull out of the race to manufacture green tech. Even if they do realise it - catching up is going to be hard.

We have this dude right here in Australia, who unlike your speaker has had a really good go at thinking about the problem and coming up with solutions. He was an advisor to the Biden administration, and many other cool academic things in this space.

This is an older video, and a short one (note I didn't give you a 1 h video!).

We need solutions not just "it's @#$@ and it won't help".

https://youtu.be/QfAXbGInwno'si=HnaevvWp5hiUuEJd

Making green tech is not the only money spinner, but having cheap energy from wind and solar is a massive economic advantage.

I know that cars in the Challenger class in the Darwin to Adelaide World Solar Challenge are not practical vehicles, but the progress over the last decade or so is impressive.
The winning car averaged 86.6km/h. That is probably faster than I did in my Series III a couple of decades ago.

Bridgestone World Solar Challenge 2025

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Originally Posted by vnx205

I know that cars in the Challenger class in the Darwin to Adelaide World Solar Challenge are not practical vehicles, but the progress over the last decade or so is impressive.
The winning car averaged 86.6km/h. That is probably faster than I did in my Series III a couple of decades ago.

Bridgestone World Solar Challenge 2025

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Yea, but you could do 50kmh at night.[biggrin]

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Originally Posted by Captain_Rightfoot

Ok.. I watched the video. He's a good speaker that's for sure. I wouldn't want to end up in a debate with him.

But he said straight up "I used to be a mechanic.. I like gas cars.. I don't like EV's". There were lots of "facts" which were at best dubious, and at worst deliberately deceptive.

And as per much in this thread it was a lot of "That's all just @#$T .. I don't like it. It's not going to work". But there are no actual answers or alternative plans. In summary, haters gonna hate. It's a democracy, and in the current climate in the US I suspect he's angling for a job. We must remember this is about the US, not Australia.Personally I think what the previous administration was doing was really going the right way. The US is going to regret the decision to pull out of the race to manufacture green tech. Even if they do realise it - catching up is going to be hard.

We have this dude right here in Australia, who unlike your speaker has had a really good go at thinking about the problem and coming up with solutions. He was an advisor to the Biden administration, and many other cool academic things in this space.

This is an older video, and a short one (note I didn't give you a 1 h video!).

We need solutions not just "it's @#$@ and it won't help".

https://youtu.be/QfAXbGInwno'si=HnaevvWp5hiUuEJd

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I don't think so. He appears to have spend years, decades studying this. He references studies to lookup in quite a few places. Like most, I don't think he is "anti" EV. He just has a brain, so doesn't want to see anything "forced" on people for no reason. I thought the cost of horses was fascinating. He would be right about the cost of electricity transmission lines. Interestingly, most of these types of people that are not green washed with stupidity, don't mention power generation. They seem to think that part can be done. Its the upgrading the existing power transmission infrastructure that is the insurmountable issue.

seeya
Shane L.

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Originally Posted by Tombie

And don't get me started on wind farm contracts with the property owners - they make a lot of money every year for the use of their land - but almost all the contracts then leave them (land holder) to remove them once the wind farm is outdated, leaving land full of concrete and rebar. All to be Green and get those subsidies to make the companies big profits quickly - almost all of which are sent offshore.

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Nope, all wind farm contracts require the operators to remediate the land at the end of the lease. And I have actually seen it proposed that the farmer might get to keep the wind turbines if they want to.

Wind farms aren't built to generate subsidies - they are subsidised but banks don't give billions of dollars to 30 year investments on the basis of some subsidies: they either meet FID or they don't proceed. What a lot of people don't get is the essential difference between a renewables facility and a gas or coal power station is that once the renewables are actually built the inputs are free - they're not subject to the vagaries of input prices changes in the way that gas and coal powered plants are. That's why renewables are wildlly cheaper than gas or coal and it's why no-one in this country is building new coal power plants, even when the Coalition promised subsidies to do so. Look up the term "stranded asset" - it's how coal plants were being described in the project finance literature even 20 years ago.

FYI, having a wind farm on your land increases its value, even with the infrastructure, the most significant of which (in terms of impact on farming activities) is the access tracks.