Thread: Holden - how long before the end?

Originally Posted by bee utey

the new Commodes come with AWD on their premium models.

Is that on all premium models or just the " all road" version targetted at the Subaru Outback?

Originally Posted by garrycol

Is that on all premium models or just the " all road" version targetted at the Subaru Outback?

Apparently the optional V6 drive train will be AWD only.

Link

Over time rear biased awd cars have gone from 40 front/60 rear, to 37 front/63 rear, and some are now 20 front/80 rear. If i had the choice, i would choose the latter.

Front biased awd? What a nasty cheap solution to making a cheap fwd car better at dealing with sliding on ice. Its not a drivers car.

Merely staying on the road is more an indictment.

Originally Posted by rammypluge

Front wheel drive and front biased all wheel drive is for when you have no more than about 75hp. I say it in hp because it reflects the fact that it is outdated. Horses need not and should not be pulling chariots anymore.

Shows you have never driven a decent modern FWD vehicle. Missus little turbo Veloster is what would only be considered a ‘warm’ hatch by today’s standards (200Hp) but it’ll rip a XR6 a new one in every respect to around 200KPH (weighs a smidge over a tonne) - it’s only after that that the XR6 will overhaul it (ask me how I know this), and if it’s in the hills and twisty bits will cain the same vehicle by miles. And again - that’s only half as good as some of the latest hot hatches - the I30N is a little missile (will know first hand in a month or so after I get to test drive one).

You can have your ‘drivers car’ and I’ll meet you at the top of the hill on my second coffee still with a grin ear to ear.

Time to get your backside in something decent, it will change your mind but I suspect you also believe in the old saying ‘there’s no substitute for cubes’ which went down the toilet decades ago as well.

Originally Posted by Homestar

Shows you have never driven a decent modern FWD vehicle. Missus little turbo Veloster is what would only be considered a ‘warm’ hatch by today’s standards (200Hp) but it’ll rip a XR6 a new one in every respect to around 200KPH (weighs a smidge over a tonne) - it’s only after that that the XR6 will overhaul it (ask me how I know this), and if it’s in the hills and twisty bits will cain the same vehicle by miles. And again - that’s only half as good as some of the latest hot hatches - the I30N is a little missile (will know first hand in a month or so after I get to test drive one).

You can have your ‘drivers car’ and I’ll meet you at the top of the hill on my second coffee still with a grin ear to ear.

Time to get your backside in something decent, it will change your mind but I suspect you also believe in the old saying ‘there’s no substitute for cubes’ which went down the toilet decades ago as well.

My 4wd has a 2.0L twin turbo, so no attachment to cubes displayed there.

They might be able to make a leather wallet out of a sows ear these days, but the veloster is still based off a cooking model hyundai, and a falcon XR6, while RWD, is also a tarted up cooking model, its not conceived on the drawing board first and foremost as a performance vehicle.

Vehicles designed to be a performance vehicle first and foremost are typically mid rear engined and RWD.

Yeah, dedicated performance vehicles yes, completely agree. Was pointing out that FWD vehicles are not old tech and that 100’s of HP is able to be funneled through the front wheels very successfully these days with bugger all torque steer and very cheap compared to a dedicated performance vehicle - by orders on magnitude.

Originally Posted by rammypluge

My 4wd has a 2.0L twin turbo, so no attachment to cubes displayed there.

They might be able to make a leather wallet out of a sows ear these days, but the veloster is still based off a cooking model hyundai, and a falcon XR6, while RWD, is also a tarted up cooking model, its not conceived on the drawing board first and foremost as a performance vehicle.

Vehicles designed to be a performance vehicle first and foremost are typically mid rear engined and RWD.

But what has all this to do with a thread on the future of Holdens? By your standards they've never ever made even one performance car, as they all have cooking oil in their DNA. And I bet your chosen turbo rocket has some recycled frying pans in it somewhere too.

Originally Posted by Homestar

Yeah, dedicated performance vehicles yes, completely agree. Was pointing out that FWD vehicles are not old tech and that 100’s of HP is able to be funneled through the front wheels very successfully these days with bugger all torque steer and very cheap compared to a dedicated performance vehicle - by orders on magnitude.

Yes, but i still reign against the term 'performance vehicle' or 'drivers car' being used for fwd and front biased awd vehicles. If someone wants to buy a drivers car, or gloat about 'their performance car', make it say a porsche boxter. Secondhand, i expect they would be in the realm of many people's budget.

Of course, the reality is that most people arent much of a driver, they dont corner near the limit of adhesion, or are aware of the differences between truly good and average, so with some marketing spin, an injection of horses and a bit more handling, you can sell them almost anything.