Thread: Thomas PTO & 12V electric winch

Originally Posted by disco2hse

Interesting looking adaptor for the electric motor.

Couple of things I think you need to consider.

• The hand crank is not likely to have sufficient bearing strength to cope with being driven from a pto. The bearings in those winches are bronze and need to be greased/oiled regularly. So don't consider trying to run a pto from the hand crank.
• If you did decide to mid-mount it and use the electric motor gearbox, the hand crank would be redundant.
• As already mentioned, the hand crank comes out the wrong side for mounting on RHD landies.
• You don't need to buy any other parts if you want to convert it to pto drive. If you are going to mount it on the front of the vehicle all you need to do is take the electric motor gearbox off the front (and put it into storage) then take the worm drive out and swap the end plate and worm drive bearing plate around so the drive shaft comes out the other side. You will also need to cut the worm drive shorter.
• The attached pdfs show what needs to be changed to convert to pto. The only cost is in cutting the shaft. It needs to be hardened after it is cut and it needs a keyway.
• If you decide to stay with the electric option, the modern integrated solenoid packs (e.g. Superwinch) are perfectly compatible with these motors and are more reliable anyway. Traxion are the place to go to.
• If you need a replacement motor, use the Iskra motors from Pan Pacific in Kelston.

Alan

PS More than a couple :}

Hi Alan,

A very useful post with loads of inside info in the attachments, thanks for that. I've got a better idea of the internals now.

One of the reasons I would like to stay electric is I already use the 'integrated' style solenoid. They are indeed reliable. I also run current with welding cable to minimise losses.

Cheers for the heads up on the Iskra motors, always good to have a local source.

Cheers,

Phil

Hi all, an update.

I got in touch with Maurice Thomas of winch industries and got to know a little bit more about the winch.

It dates from around 1980-1985. Great because it is the same era as my truck. It has a ratio of 462:1 or there abouts. It takes ATF in the main gear chamber and EP90 in the worm drive body. All parts are still off the shelf. It is not recommended to connect to a PTO. It can take up to 70 metres of 8mm rope. It'll draw 250 amps at 2460kgs on a full drum (supposedly) while pulling 1.8m/min.

I bought it the other day - for a sum slightly less than I would have paid for a new chinese planetary low mount 9500lb winch. Not a bad price (in my eyes for solidly engineered stuff) and also considering it came with a brand new motor to replace the one attached. Apparently this boiled some oil that leaked through the seal so they got a replacement but crashed the truck before fixing.



(the bonnet is up only to water blast the motor area while also blasting the winch clean)

I have had a good look at the innards as far as getting the small pinion off the winch motor drive. it is stuck but I am working on it slowly.

I have yet to pull the worm gear cover off but I figure it'll be the same as what I found in the pinion and spur gears.



Some surface rust on the gears but surface only and all teeth are accounted for and still have the machined look about them. All bronze bushes seem to be fine and the ball bearing on the hand crank shaft spins but may need replacing as it feel slightly pitted.

I am going to be mid-mounting this winch between the cab and the tray and it will spool out towards the back just under the tray. It will get to the end of the tray and head back towards the front around a greasible (8000kg) rated shackle. Once it gets to the rear cross member suspending the A-frame, it will head downward (again via a suspended a greasible (8000kg) rated shackle) to the gearbox mount on the passenger side. It will then get another change of direction (via a greasible (8000kg) rated shackle welded to a mounting plate) to straight-line it and come out beside the passenger side of the chassis rail where it will exit a shortened roller fairlead.

At the rear of the truck will be another roller fairlead to the rear of the shackle. if I need to winch backwards, I will undo the shackle and pull the rope in a loop through he fairlead and reconnect the shackle and be able to winch backwards via a double purchase.

The winch will be facing such that I can attach a very long crank to the shaft seen above from the rear of the tray. I will organise this so that the pipe or rod that connects the shaft will be disconnected whilst normal electricity reigns supreme but then if I strike a flat battery or a motor issue, I can connect the crank to the shaft and "unfold" a handle and continue with the winch, albeit slowly. An insurance policy if you like.

All this is in planning stage as yet and actual route may differ but I have looked at it for sometime now and see only small issues now.

Does anyone have any advice or information to assist. I would love to get some manuals or other information about this winch. It is a EW 8000 HC model.

I will keep this updated from time to time as progress occurs.

Cheers,

Phil

Have you reversed that image? The motor is on the opposite side to Relay and my winches.


Also does anyone have any dimensions on the cradle to mount these winches onto a 110 chassis?

IMAGE_379.jpg
IMAGE_378.jpg


heres the back of mine, as I posted before your motor is on the opposing side


I was told this is an electric/PTO when I bought it

Originally Posted by dobbo

Have you reversed that image? The motor is on the opposite side to Relay and my winches.


Also does anyone have any dimensions on the cradle to mount these winches onto a 110 chassis?

Hey Dobbo,

No the image is as I see it on the garge floor. Maurice Thomas indicated they were made both right handed and left. I appear to have an unusual one in that all I have seen have been the other side. indeed the first photo in my original post was from the internet showing the opposite to what I have.

All good for me though, as mid mounted facing to the rear I have very short runs of copper to get from battery to winch motor.

As far as winch dimensions, I have looked at this website and it has dimensions of their (winch Industries) hydraulic winchs using these winch platforms as their basis. Go to winchs>truck winches>[electrical, mechanical or hydraulic] on the top menu bar.

Maybe the measurements in these will assist, found in the technical drawing section in the hydraulic winches.

Cheers,

Phil

Originally Posted by dobbo

IMAGE_379.jpg
IMAGE_378.jpg


heres the back of mine, as I posted before your motor is on the opposing side


I was told this is an electric/PTO when I bought it

Wow, ok that is very different. yet another configuration from Thomas uhh? Do you have a photo of the other side?

Cheers,

Phil

Originally Posted by dobbo

IMAGE_379.jpg
IMAGE_378.jpg


heres the back of mine, as I posted before your motor is on the opposing side


I was told this is an electric/PTO when I bought it

Hi Dobbo,

I think I have it figured out to an extent.

Your one most likely is an electric and PTO driven winch as your input shaft goes directly to the worm drive with ratio 50:1 or thereabouts, whereas mine has to go through some serious reductions and is not a direct drive to the worm. Therein is the key difference between your one and mine.

Trouble I have with the concept of a winch utilising both electric and PTO is that when utilising the electric part, unless there is a clutch, the electric will also drive to drive back through to the PTO on the gearbox will it not? There is no clutch present on my one other than the dog clutch controlling the spooling and drive from whatever source. If i connected mine to a PTO I would be trying to power up the PTO/LT230 also.

Cheers,

Phil

I bought the thing a year or two ago and as you can see have not utilized it as yet, don't know about the PTO setup, interested in finding out though.

Mine is a 3941 B if anyone knows anything about it.