EV general discussion

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Originally Posted by NavyDiver

My current cheap EV can charge are 170ish kWh. The solid state battery may be 10 time that! Not enough time to get a coffee IF the charge capacity is available!

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Might be in a handful of locations but forget it out of the city - that's more power for 1 charger than most towns consume. I just did a job where there was 16,750KVA of generation installed (16 x 20' contanerised generators which were consuming around 3,000 litres of diesel an hour between them) - so less than 10 chargers worth at say 1,500KW for these super duper solid state batteries if they were all being used together.

We were running the towns of Charlton, Wycheproof, Boort, Wedderburn, St Arnaud, Donald and surrounds with them during a 66KV maintenance outage with these gens - Donald and St Arnaud were drawing around 1,600KW most of the day - 2 decent towns - same as 1 charger going full boar... There isn't capacity anywhere on this system to install even one charger above around 350KW. I just can't see what difference solid state batteries will make as their charging speed will be limited by the chargers - which is limited by the network. I can also assure you there are no plans to upgrade any of these lines to cope with EV's either as there is no return on investment and the networks are privately owned.

It goes back to what I've been saying for ages - where is the power coming from for this 'EV Revolution' - and even if it can be made, how is it going to get where it's needed? We're not talking about millions of dollars to make this work but 100's of Billions. Project Energy connect - which would be a drop in the ocean compared to what would be required to bring EV's to everyone is going to nudge 3 billion and that's just one backbone upgrade for the renewables that's coming, nothing to get any extra power to towns, just so we can start switching off the coal and getting the power from new locations back to the terminal stations.

Sorry, rant over - I'm sure someone will call me an EV hater again for pointing out inconvenient pesky facts...

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Originally Posted by Homestar

Sorry, rant over - I'm sure someone will call me an EV hater again for pointing out inconvenient pesky facts...

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Not facts, Gav. FUD, remember?

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Originally Posted by scarry

If the MG range is that bad compared with the specs,isn't it false advertising?

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I guess you would have to prove that the range quoted was not to the stated standard. For example MG actually state the range for the MG Excite 64 is 450km (WLTP) ‡ (and on the website they even add the words “up to” to cover their butt).

‡Range based on Worldwide Harmonised Light-Duty Vehicles Test Procedure (WLTP) static laboratory combined average city and highway cycle test, which measures, energy consumption, range and emissions in passenger vehicles, designed to provide figures closer to real-world driving behaviour. Actual driving results will vary depending on various factors such as driving style, type of journey, environment, battery age and condition, use of vehicle features, operating, and climate conditions.

It is the same test cycle used for ICE’s but really is a meaningless test if you want to know the actual drivable range. I personally believe they should just quote the energy consumption per 100km.

So NavyDiver - what energy usage per 100km are you achieving when you do your country driving?

Just so you can see that I'm aware that diesel trucks can burn. Former employer had this. A faulty repair caused a fuel leak, possibly directly onto the turbo but I don't know that for certain. Note the condition of the fuel tank.

BTW, the cab was damaged but not destroyed. It was sold.

Attachment 187960Attachment 187961

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Originally Posted by Homestar

Might be in a handful of locations but forget it out of the city - that's more power for 1 charger than most towns consume. I just did a job where there was 16,750KVA of generation installed (16 x 20' contanerised generators which were consuming around 3,000 litres of diesel an hour between them) - so less than 10 chargers worth at say 1,500KW for these super duper solid state batteries if they were all being used together.

We were running the towns of Charlton, Wycheproof, Boort, Wedderburn, St Arnaud, Donald and surrounds with them during a 66KV maintenance outage with these gens - Donald and St Arnaud were drawing around 1,600KW most of the day - 2 decent towns - same as 1 charger going full boar... There isn't capacity anywhere on this system to install even one charger above around 350KW. I just can't see what difference solid state batteries will make as their charging speed will be limited by the chargers - which is limited by the network. I can also assure you there are no plans to upgrade any of these lines to cope with EV's either as there is no return on investment and the networks are privately owned.

It goes back to what I've been saying for ages - where is the power coming from for this 'EV Revolution' - and even if it can be made, how is it going to get where it's needed? We're not talking about millions of dollars to make this work but 100's of Billions. Project Energy connect - which would be a drop in the ocean compared to what would be required to bring EV's to everyone is going to nudge 3 billion and that's just one backbone upgrade for the renewables that's coming, nothing to get any extra power to towns, just so we can start switching off the coal and getting the power from new locations back to the terminal stations.

Sorry, rant over - I'm sure someone will call me an EV hater again for pointing out inconvenient pesky facts...

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No hater and no rant,it is reality.

Many don’t seem to understand how much power they consume when charging.

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Originally Posted by Homestar

Might be in a handful of locations but forget it out of the city - that's more power for 1 charger than most towns consume. I just did a job where there was 16,750KVA of generation installed (16 x 20' contanerised generators which were consuming around 3,000 litres of diesel an hour between them) - so less than 10 chargers worth at say 1,500KW for these super duper solid state batteries if they were all being used together.

We were running the towns of Charlton, Wycheproof, Boort, Wedderburn, St Arnaud, Donald and surrounds with them during a 66KV maintenance outage with these gens - Donald and St Arnaud were drawing around 1,600KW most of the day - 2 decent towns - same as 1 charger going full boar... There isn't capacity anywhere on this system to install even one charger above around 350KW. I just can't see what difference solid state batteries will make as their charging speed will be limited by the chargers - which is limited by the network. I can also assure you there are no plans to upgrade any of these lines to cope with EV's either as there is no return on investment and the networks are privately owned.

It goes back to what I've been saying for ages - where is the power coming from for this 'EV Revolution' - and even if it can be made, how is it going to get where it's needed? We're not talking about millions of dollars to make this work but 100's of Billions. Project Energy connect - which would be a drop in the ocean compared to what would be required to bring EV's to everyone is going to nudge 3 billion and that's just one backbone upgrade for the renewables that's coming, nothing to get any extra power to towns, just so we can start switching off the coal and getting the power from new locations back to the terminal stations.

Sorry, rant over - I'm sure someone will call me an EV hater again for pointing out inconvenient pesky facts...

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Rant on. Fully agree the sods claiming they are doing LOTS when its not even a Scratch on what is needed now and a fly speck on the real need for Heat pumps and other electrification required. My Nuclear stocks are all telling me what the rest of the world is doing. 20lbs 3 years ago. $40lbs 2 years ago and USD$60 Dec 2022 now over $80lbs and not stopping!

NOT Investments advise. I may build off grid soon as the unaccountability of many such as todays BIG Battery $$$$$$$$ for a few people for a few hours only made me think of Grumpy Old or Current affair rant myself [biggrin]

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Originally Posted by Homestar

Yes, both ICE and EV vehicle catch fire, for me it’s more about how hard an EV fire is to put out, how much hotter it burns and how toxic the smoke is.

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I thought this was true as well - especially when it comes to the total heat involved, but this research from Korea shows the peak heat output and total heat output is very similar between a BEV and ICE fire. It is really only Fuel Cell vehicles which released more total heat, but they peak lower.

https://pure.ulster.ac.uk/ws/portalf...17548_main.pdf

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...4dc406c683.jpg

What they found was the battery pack itself only accounted for a small % of the total heat being released, approximately 15% in total, and it is actually the remainder of the car which releases most of the energy.

Interesting development here in the UK. It appears that in most cases to install an electric vehicle charging point you have to up grade the sun station. The sub station upgrade was coming in at an average of £500k. This number is from charging industry so take it as you will. Seems that stumping up for this cost was putting companies off installing a lot of charging points as they would never be able to make a profit. So new rule is that this cost is now passed back into the overall costs of everyone who uses electricity not the company that wants to install the charging point. They still have to pay for the infrastructure to get the power from the sub station to the charging point though.

https://youtu.be/CihLQcdHayI'si=zLm0Te2i5NuD9nu3

I wonder how the Koreans would add this to their graph.

https://youtu.be/cUVZR7OIelk'si=BhZY1YBPOYQxMk4n